Abandon All Fear

What nobody else seems to be saying…

The Religion of Hate

Posted by Lex Fear on November 9, 2007

You have heard it argued that religion is the cause of all violence and war in the world. You have heard it argued that creationists are ignorant and stupid. You have heard it implied that atheism is the religion of peace, that evolution is the belief and consensus of intellectuals and scientists.

Atheism = Peace
Religion = Hate

But what does the enlightened anti-theist make of Pekka-Eric Auvinen aka Sturmgeist89 aka NaturalSelector89?

The link above points to a screen-cap of the Finland killer’s suspended YouTube profile (via the Australian Daily Telegraph), whereupon he had posted a video with him holding a gun interspersed with pictures of his high school, hours before killing 7 of his fellow students and one adult.

In case the image ever disappears or references get taken down, I am reproducing the complete text from his profile here. It makes an interesting read, especially his pro-evolution stance and his views on religious people. I’ve read many a forum and comments page with similar views, it seems Auvinen just had the balls to act on his beliefs:

“Sturmgeist89
aka NaturalSelector89 (3/15/2007 – 10/19/2007).

YouTube suspended my previous account but I am back now 🙂 My new account name is German and means “Stormspirit” in English.

Name: Pekka-Eric Auvinen
Age: 18
Male from Finland.

I am a cynical existentialist, antihuman humanist, antisocial social darwinist, realistic idealist and godlike atheist.

SOCIETY

Revolutions will come, governments will collapse, manipulative mafia & idiocratic rule of majority will be replaced by freedom and justice.

My utopia: Weak minded people are slaves, intelligent people as free. What I mean is that they who think deep political & philosophical issues, and are capable of intelligent existential thinking, should be free rulers… and the weak minded masses / robots, they can be slaves since they do not mind it now either and because their minds are so on retarded level. The gangsters that now rule societies will get what they deserve.

Realist views: Hate… I’m so full of it and I love it. That is one thing I really love. It is almost impossible to change the system. The faster human race is wiped out from the planet, the better… no-one should be left alive. No mercy for the scum of the earth.

F— political correctness, f— equality, f— tolerance and f— democracy…

…and what is democracy anyway? Dictatorship of the moral majority which is manipulated by state mafia. Modern western democracy has nothing to do with freedom and justice; it is totalitarian and corrupted system.

Long live the REVOLUTION against the system, which enslaves not only the weak-minded retards but also the small minority of intelligent and strong-minded people.

LIFE:

Life is just a coincidence… result of long process of evolution and many several factors, causes and effects. However, life is also something that an individual wants and determines it to be. And I… I’m the dictator of my own life.

What is the best thing in life? It ends. Well I guess there are some other great things, worth living for, but sometimes you lose them or don’t get them.

Today the process of natural selection is totally misguided. Modern human race has not only betrayed it’s ancestors, but the future generations too.

It’s time to put NATURAL SELECTION & SURVIVAL OF THE FITTEST back on tracks!

RELIGION:

Religious people, your gods are nothing and exist only in your heads. Your slave morals means nothing to me. I’m the god & devil of my own life.

Evolution is a theory and a fact, creationism is neither one.

If hell and heaven really existed… all the interesting people would go to hell!

PHILOSOPHY:

HUMANITY IS OVERRATED!

Human life is not sacred. Humans are just a species among other animals and world does not exist only for humans. Death is not a tragedy, it happens in nature all the time between species. Not all human lives are important or worth saving. Sometimes I feel like no-one is really worth of life at all.

Due to long process of existential thinking, observing the society I live and some other things happened in my life… I have come to the point where I feel nothing but hate against humanity and human race.

There are no other universal laws than the laws of nature and the laws of physics.

Trust no one… and rely on your instincts.

I am the law, judge and executioner. There is no higher authority than me.

Justice renders to everyone his due.

Country: Finland

Occupation: Unemployed Philosopher, Outcast

Companies: Human Race (evolved one step above though)

Interests and Hobbies: Existentialism, Freedom, Truth, Misantrophy, Social / Personality Psychology, Evolution Science, Political Incorrectness, Women, BDSM, Guns (I love you Catherine), Shooting, Computer Games, Sarcasm, Irony, Mass / Serial Killers, Macabre Art, Black Comedy, Absurdism

Movies and Shows: The Matrix, A View To A Kill, Falling Down, Natural Born Killers, Reservoir Dogs, Last Man Standing, Full Metal Jacket, Dr. Butcher MD (aka Zombie Holocaust), Saw 1-3, Lord Of War, The Deer Hunter, True Romance, The Untouchables, 28 Days Later, 28 Weeks Later, Idiocracy, They Live, Apocalypse Now, End Of Days, The Shining, The Dead Zone, Dr. Strangelove, House MD (TV), Monty Python, TV Documentaries Relating To History

Music: KMFDM, Rammstein, Eisbrecher, Nine Inch Nails, Grendel, Impaled Nazarene, Macabre, Deathstars, The Prodigy, Combichrist, Godsmack, Slayer, Children Of Bodom, Alice Cooper, Sturmgeist, Suicide Commando, Hatebreed, Suffocation, Terrorizer

Books: Fahrenheit 451 (Bradbury), 1984 (Orwell), Brave New World (Huxley), The Republic (Plato), all works of Nietzsche

If the religious moderates are the ones that enable the religious extremists to kill, what can be said of the atheist moderates?

This ties in well with a debate I had on Yellows blog a while ago with a chap called Robhu who had some of the same arguments and reasoning as Auvinen above.

You can follow the debate here: Heavy Sigh, Deeper Sigh and Deepest Sigh.

By the third post, Robhu had given up reason and shuffled back to his own blog to rant and rave over Alex Fear. Something I said must have really affected him because he devoted not one, not two but four posts (1, 2, 3, 4), to Alex Fear, all highly emotive (no longer interested in continuing the debate).

Robhu decided his argument was won, not by intellectual reasoning but by the sardonic application of Godin’s Law. Since the reasoning of Robhu’s arguments lay on the basis that all religious people are extremists, and the tolerant religious people simply enable the extremists, I decided to parody Godin’s Law and come up with my own reference: Yellow’s Law (admittedly I failed on comic timing):

“As an online discussion of religion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving terrorism or suicide bombers approaches one.”

As I stated in the comments on another post, which I feel deserves an airing on the index page:

With regards to violence perpetrated throughout history, at least, before the 20th Century, it’s a mute point. The fact is all violence before the 20th Century would have it’s roots or connections to religion because all peoples of the world believed in a God of some sort. Atheism and Evolutionism has only gained ground and become the mainstream in the last 150 years, which is why you now have football supporters now warring against each other in the streets, rather than rival religions- they are human beings, they are hard of heart and don’t listen to God.

As I’ve been trying to suggest all along, perhaps it’s time everyone realised that neither religion, nor atheism causes violence (though both may be used to justify it), rather there is a third collective religion/meme/system of belief that has spread through humanity ever since Cain slew Abel. The religion of hate.

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18 Responses to “The Religion of Hate”

  1. mattghg said

    That guy Robhu is a howl. After that debate on Yellow’s blog I carried on another (one, two) on my own blog about some of the points it raised, and some of my own. His mate Paul and I had a very reasonable discussion. Did Rob get involved? No, even though previously he’d been confident enough in his own supreme intelligence to call everyone in sight stupid or irrational or both (as you found out). No, instead he “shuffled back to his own blog” again to comment that apparently I’d taken a “spanking” – while only linking to what Paul had said and nothing of what I had said! *Sigh*

  2. Cecilieaux said

    The problem with your whole line of argument (not original, see here) is that while there have been ample instances of people invoking the deity for the purpose of urging on others to disembowel someone else, there are no instances of people specifically invoking the deity’s non-existence.

    What you offer is no more than the rant of a troubled youth who was vaguely nihilistic. This boy is a walking, talking cliche.

    For the other side, I can give you popes, reverends, mahdis and even plain Englishmen aplenty urging their fellow men to draw swords and kill “by God!”

  3. @Matt

    These guys seem to be terribly bitter at the church from past experiences (I know Rob asserts that he was at some point a ‘Christian’). But the whole problem is they see the Christian experience as being part of a church and partaking in the activities of the church, not a relationship with God, which is what being a “little anointed one” is.

    People who think going to church and doing the actions is what being a Christian means are sadly misguided and will never meet the real Jesus or become Christians.

    I also tire of the arguments that become circular in nature, along with premises that switch bases. For example they’ll argue on a premise as though God exists and when they can’t refute your answers their premise will switch to non-existence of God. It’s like arguing the number of floors in a house with someone who thinks it’s a bungalow. It’s a categorical error and the whole point is lost.

    @Cec

    Did this boy invoke any deity? Not that I can see. He invoked evolution and his argument is a persuasive one. After all, if mutation is supposed to happen, why do scientists and biologists spend so much time trying to preserve the human race as it, rather than letting things happen? Survival of the fittest, as they say. The whole concept of having governments, armies, police and justice doesn’t make sense. Do we see lions taking each other to court because one lion aggrieved the other? Do we see birds purposely damage/clip their wings because they believe that inside themselves they were actually meant to be a dog and they long to walk?

    I’m not arguing that the boy isn’t a cliche, a mere troubled youth. But what if he had been reading the Bible instead of Nietzsche? I’m pretty sure that anti-theists would be jumping all over it by now.

    Sure you can list a lot of historical figures (and maybe a few present ones) who have used God to justify their hate. Guess what, there always will be- but (1) the scriptures were not written for this purpose and (2) for every bad person who used God to justify their bad deeds, there are hundreds of believers who are influenced by the Holy Spirit to do good (and not only do they not get a mention, they don’t try to publicise themselves either).

    Finally, maybe their are few examples of anti-theists right now who have taken it this far, but it’s practically guaranteed that as anti-theism and secularism takes hold amongst the nations, there will be more bad deeds perpetrated by atheists than there will be by people who believe in God.

    Being open to all, as the church is, unfortunate does occasionally attract some unhinged individuals. Sadly in some cases the church fails them, or they simply didn’t get the message. At least the church tries to address the problem even if it fails.

    But as proved above, evolutionism does not have and will never provide the answer to troubled youths, psychopaths or killers.

  4. Stef said

    The problem with your whole line of argument (not original, see here) is that while there have been ample instances of people invoking the deity for the purpose of urging on others to disembowel someone else, there are no instances of people specifically invoking the deity’s non-existence.

    Hmmmm, it’s unlikely you’d be able to find many examples of people specifically invoking their absence of belief in something as being a positive motivation to do anything at all

    I have an absence of belief in the Spaghetti Monster for example. An absence of belief which specifically compels me to do … not very much at all

    A fairer point to make would be to demonstrate that an active belief in a deity somehow makes people more murderous than any other strongly held belief

    Given that the most murderous conflicts, genocides and mass exploitations of at least the last couple of hundred years or so didn’t seem to swing on theological issues I’d suggest that there are plenty of other beliefs out there which are head and shoulders above the abuse of religion in the murderousness stakes

    Racial differences seem to have been quite popular for example and whilst religions such as Christianity and Islam make no distinction between races evolutionary theory can, and has been, readily twisted to ‘prove’ that it’s OK, even desirable, to engage in a spot of ethnic cleansing

    And yet secular humanists bang on about religion as if it’s the Number One cause of all human misery

    Why would that be?

    FWIW I’m an agnostic but one of my own strongly held beliefs is that I can often spot a distraction when I see one

  5. lwtc247 said

    It can also be argued that people who commit violence in the name of God are simply lying. There are a number of references to those who believe in God who do not but as ever where’s the ‘cred in knowing about them?

    Anyway, a good examle is the strong arguement that can be put forward about the Crusades. They were primarily wars for the usual suspects: Economic advantage and the Power of rule over people.

    Trade routes from the East were drying up, largely delivering to other new centres of economic power. The Church of Rome had also lost unifying authority over many of East Europes Christians. These period of decay was characterised by the dark ages.

    The thirst for riches grew in Western Europe and the Papacy longed for a unified church akin to that achieved by King Constantine I, coincidently responsible for the relative independence of the Byzantine Christians! These Christians had little need to fight life was relatively secure. So mercenaries from the West were gathered up and the “for God” cry went out as a rallying call to pesants with nothing to lose other than no longer living in their own filth.

    Or of course you can choose th think that the Muslims were raping and sacking the holy crap out of everything and intended to kill every Christian in Europe because they hated our way of life and so they went to war to “fight them over there, so we didn’t have to fight them over here”

    Which ever version you subscribe to, the use of God for Satanic acts cannot be ignored.

    Those who do not learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat it.

  6. stef said

    The very profitable Fourth Crusade, when the crusaders couldn’t even be bothered to get to the Holy Land and sacked Christian Constantinople instead, being a very nice illustration of the previous point

  7. Cecilieaux said

    Stef & Lwtc:

    The direct line of causation between religion and violence is amply established. There have been hundreds, indeed thousands, of very murderous Christians (romish, bloody prod and nearly every other kind), Muslims, Hindus and so on, who have specifically invoked the imaginary being they deem to be a god as justification for their murderous behavior.

    Were they *all* lying, Lwtc? I’d like to see some evidence.

    Sure, there were baser motives, Stef, as shown in the Fourth Crusade. The point remains that religion aids and abets these motives, serves them, gives them comfort. Find the religious gathering and you will likely find the pervert and the hypocrite.

    Cecilieaux
    Shavings Off My Mind

  8. Stef said

    Find any political gathering and you will likely find the pervert and the hypocrite

    Come to think of it, most gatherings of people who feel strongly about an issue will attract people with loose mental wiring

    So what is the point you’re trying to make?

    That human beings sometimes use violence to force their views on other humans?

    I wouldn’t argue with that

    But as far as religion goes you haven’t actually addressed my point that virtually all of the wars and genocides of at least the last few hundred years didn’t have much to do with religion at all – quite the opposite. Stalin, Mao and Hitler for example were big Darwin fans

    So what is it that really is the cause of all wars? Religion doesn’t seem to be a viable candidate

  9. Stef said

    …and there is a very specific reason why I am concerned by focus on religion as being the supposed cause of much of the world’s ills

    And that is the fact that the ‘Clash of Civilisations’ bullcrap that has been forced down our necks, stoked-up and amplified in recent years is a device being used by powerful political and financial interests to smokescreen aggression, theft and a bid for global hegemony. None of that would cease if the religious impulse was eradicated from humanity entirely overnight. They’d just find something else to divide us. Race probably

    The irony of this is that, particularly in America, liberal humanists think that the interests behind neo-conservatism are enraged by assaults on religion when in fact they love every minute of it

  10. cecilieaux said

    First off, I wouldn’t say that religion is the cause of much of the world’s ills. Go argue that with someone else.

    I would rather say that the more I know Christians the more I like my girlfriend’s cat.

    As to wars being cause by factors other than religion, as a good Marxist, how could you believe otherwise? Then again, I never said religion caused wars. I just said that murder — including in war and not — has been often justified by appeal to the imaginary deity.

    Cecilieaux
    Shavings Off My Mind

  11. Stef said

    I’m actually a terrible Marxist and see it, along with secular humanism, as being no less of a religion than belief systems which require acceptance of a deity

    And if you feel that I was putting words into your mouth I apologise

  12. cecilieaux said

    Stef: In calling you a “good Marxist,” I was trying, elliptically perhaps, to point out that the whole superstructure argument for war is essentially an insight from Marxism.

    It’s amazing how this thread has continued, isn’t it?

  13. Alex Fear said

    Well, looks like I missed the debate due to some problems with my landline (and hence broadband)- never mind, that is for another post.

    @Cec, you are right in that religion/God is easily used to justify war, I cannot agree more, and neither could anyone else here. However to say that religion is the cause of war is a logical fallacy (as discussed on this blog elsewhere) just as it is to assume that cars are the major cause of road accidents, when it is eg. poor driving skills.

    @Stef, the American conservative elite has for a long time duped the Religious Right Wrong for a long time, anyone who has had a dose of wisdom has been able to see this. Jim Wallis has written extensively on this (I recommend his book, God’s Politics). Eg. Faith Based-Initiatives were basically a great big lie, the “moral majority” leaders were bought off by association and gifts and made promises but nothing came of it- it was a ploy for their votes. The corruption of the leaders of the Religious Wrong is now exposing itself as those who campaigned for candidates who decried abortion are now supporting the likes of Rudy Giuliani. It was always a big lie, and a big elephant in the room.

    @LW, I don’t doubt that most people who commit murder in the name of God are sincere in their thinking they are carrying out God’s work. Just as those who commit murder in the name of social darwinism truly believe they are doing it for survival. However, it’s the underlying motives and the God that they set up in their heads which dictates these things.

    First off, I can’t speak for religions outside of the Christian faith, however I know that in the bible God explicitly states “vengeance is mine”. These words are not just a reminder for the wicked that they will be held to account, but a reminder for us not to go out and take our own vengeance on others (especially since we can be the ones in the wrong). If God wanted someone dead, he could manage that by himself, which is why I fundamentally believe in a God of love. He has all the power in the universe and yet He cannot force us to love Him freely. Whether God exists or not, human beings love and have emotions. If God created us to love, then He knows what it is to love, if He knows what it is to love surely He would want to be loved? The only way He could cause us to love Him is by the way He works in the world now. Not being quick to judge, not starting wars and not invading our lives.

    Imagine the concept of a God that got involved in every single thing we did whether we wanted it or not? It’s late at night, you’re watching porn… suddenly God appears- blows up your television set, summons your family to appear right there in the room (no time to pull up your trousers) and gives you a dressing down in front of them all. Would you choose to love God then? even I’d be an anti-theist!

  14. lwtc247 said

    Cecilieaux. It’s a logical statement.
    If people do things against religion but in the NAME of religion. They are clearly lying.

    They may have been God worshipping people before of even after the event, but AT the event, they were Godless and do Godless things. The crime and therefore its perpetrators had nothing to do with God other than profainig His name and putting forth a very great lie indeed.

    Alex’s point is good that they believe it is in the name of god, but it is still a lie. A self deluding one.

    I remember in history class as a 13 year old how the Roman church used to sell ‘deeds’ (but can’t remember the term – absolution??) to forgive their sins. With a few in hand, one could use them up as need be and go out to do some crime. Just make sure the crime yielded more money than the cost of the absolving deeds.

    I’m not saying so called Muslims are free of such crimes either, but I think it’s quite well established that it was the “god” kings of europe, what were the instigators, Just like ‘god’ told bush to invade afghanistan.

    To finish, let me modify your statement…
    “THE MANIPULATION OF religion aids and abets these motives” and it always (Seems to me at least) to stem from idolitry of “Leaders”. Eeeew.

    And Stef “Stalin, Mao and Hitler for example were big Darwin fans” Lovely! – To me that shows it’s the same force at work but doesn’t need the religion (fake) cloak any more to advance those nefarious goals, but once again that cloak has been dusted off in the realisation that with the terror label sewn on the cloaks hoodie, it can achieve the same effect.

    And may I say, I like your point about the US liberal or anti-creationists as they could equally be called. A point I agree with – they are blinded by the same games of religion put forwards by the same elite forces that are always behind it.

    Re: ““vengeance is mine”. Islamically Muslims have the right to undertake acts of physical struggle/war to fight their oppression. God will of course judge all accordingly, but Muslims don’t have to allow all crimes comitted against them on this earth. Many Christians seem to take the pacifist role, sincerely of course becasue they believe it is by Divine instruction, but I wonder if this is such a valid stance or a distortion brought into christianity to passify Christians from rebelling agsint the Papacy? I wonder what the other ‘left’ out Gospels say?

    God can force us but doesn’t – He allows us to have free will. It is to the Splendour of God that we can still acept Him by belief and observation of the beauty inherent in Mathematics and the Physical universe, even in a single electron which exists throughout the visible univese at the same time.

    & commiserations to the bloke who didn’t have enough time to pull his trousers up!

  15. mattghg said

    Re: robhu (again), I just found out there is an important back story you should know about. It explains a lot.

  16. afear said

    “…and some fell amongst the thorns”

  17. Hello I found this blog using search engine while searching for Theism Beauty and your post regarding The Religion of Hate looks very interesting for me

  18. Doulos said

    The explination for this individual is right at the very bottom of his favorite books list: “all works of Nietzsche”

    His views of natural selection and survival of the fittest, the idea that the strong should rule and the masses should be slaves or killed out is very Nietzchean. And is it any surprise that he would shoot up his school after being dedicated to the ideal of a Nietzchean Uberman? Nietzche after all was driven to insanity from the logical conclusions of his philosophy as well.

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